The world is upside down. While the US under Obama is supporting the Iranian regime, France and other European leaders have spoken out. They have condemned the regime and their violence against the Iranian people. Not to long ago, it was America that supported people’s aspirations and Europeans backing tyrants.
European leaders condemn Iranian violence
European leaders today parted company with a cautious White House in their response to events in Iran, with France and Italy speaking out against the brutal treatment of demonstrators protesting at the presidential election result.
Nicolas Sarkozy, the French president, described the situation in Iran as “extremely alarming” and denounced as “totally disproportionate” the crackdown on demonstrators, which has left eight people dead.
Sarkozy, who was in Gabon for the funeral of President Omar Bongo, said: “The ruling power claims to have won the elections … If that were true, we must ask why they find it necessary to imprison their opponents and repress them with such violence.”
The world is indeed upside down.
Tags: Europe, Nicolas Sarkozy, Pro Islamic America
Alright, FINE! FIRST!!!!
Just heard on Fox that hackers all over the world are assisting students in screwing with government websites. Pictures are being released through twitter from the students.
The World Turned Upside Down
/Victor Davis Hanson
Excerpt
Iran must not owe any money to France. Otherwise …
The Fwence have always been more fond of the muslims in turkey, lebanon, syria, iraq, jordan, sudan, libya, algeria, morocco.
You know, the Ottoman caliphate.
Of course it could just be that they came out for the students because Obambi is backing the mullahs. (sarkozy got a glimpse of michelle’s glare at carla the other day and wants to do some eye-poking)
Oh. You mean like the France did in Vietnam in the 50’s? Oh, and like they did in Algeria in the 60’s? Oh, and (going way back)like they did during the 1st republic? (for those of you from Rio Linda that was the French Revolution in 1792.)
P.S. just had to add this: “bongo, bongo, bongo, I don’t want to leave the congo oh,oh,oh.
OT but on point. Careful what you say.
Let the outings begin. Here and here.
re: #5 by Sparky
Let’s hope the pr*ck in Iran who did this gets “outed”
re: #6 by BuddyG
Linky no worky.
re: #7 by jakee308
It works for me. Can anyone else see it?
Anyway, try refreshing your browser while that URL is in the address field
re: #8 by BuddyG
Sorry Bud,invisible to me.
re: #5 by Sparky
As long as one does not advocate violence or use phrases with the intent of rousing others to violence, one has nothing to fear. Of course that would be if we still lived in a country that was governed strictly by the rule of law.
I fear that we have slipped into a transitional period between republic and empire. It is highlighted by extreme acts in the name of factionalism with the majority of factions led by charismatic leaders who evoke paroxysms of violence by their followers toward their current enemies or those who attempt to reason with them or maintain the old forms of government. This violence may or may not be sanctioned by the faction leader(s) but will be derived from the faction’s stated goals/purpose of focus and the pandering rhetoric used by the leader(s) to hold sway over their followers.
The next stage will be the arrival of a “savior”. A penultimate charismatic leader who has the ability to attract and unite the majority of the factions under their sway. This alliance will be used by the “savior” during the introductory period when the fundamental changes to the form of government takes place. (see Gaius Julius Octavius a.k.a. Augustus Caesar the first Roman Emperor)
re: #8 by BuddyG
Still don’t work. I would guess that the pic has been pulled. Especially likely if it depicts an iranian being attacked by someone representing the state of Iran. Plus if the server is in Iran then it could be it was taken offline along with alot of others.
the overseas “pipe” in totalitarian countries are restricted and restrictive and usually are controlled by state organs.
re: #1 by vapig
Tell me if this ought not appear, and I’ll delete it pronto –not sure how these things work…..
http://www.boingboing.net/2009/06/16/cyberwar-guide-for-i.html
re: #10 by jakee308
Yes that is what I see coming. Obama is Pompey, who will be Ceasar?
Sheesh is there a special on tv or something? it’s only 20:00 edt and no one else is here?
I feel like that guy in the movie 28 Days.
hello? hello? hello?
hello? hello? hello?
hello? hello? hello?
I couldn’t watch the thing cause that went on for about ten minutes or so. I gave up and ejected the dvd. Yechh!! That and babies crying. Directors like to use them to build suspense or to humanize and otherwise wicked character but me I can’t stand it if the device is used for more that one or two scenes. I bought Shoot Em Up and this guy has this baby that he got from a preganant woman who got killed during the beginning shoot out. I stopped the dvd after about 5 minutes of that kid wailing.
Why do they do that? Directors who do that should be put into a room and those sounds should be played for about 2-3 hours. When it’s over I guarantee the f**ker’ll never use a baby crying or someone saying hello for ten minutes again.
re: #14 by jakee308
Well, I don’t watch tv, but I always knew I was considered no one…..
/ : )
re: #10 by jakee308
Took me awhile to digest that all, yep, the times they are a changing. Seems to be no pause between the changes lately. Without checks and balances it’s a run away train(wreck).
On topic finally, the french words mean little to me
no one has taken any action to help out. Bush may have put troops on the Iraqi borders to pressure them and divert there attention.
re: #13 by Rodan
haven’t a clue yet. I expect this individual to appear within 2 yrs. They will most likely come to prominence during some crisis that they will resolve to the relief of all. (it most likely will be a crisis derived from the chaos of the current administration and may have been instigated by the powerful around this “savior”)
You see folks how important an enquiring and skeptical media is? Does anyone understand how dangerous is the surrender by the media to Obama is?
The only thing that can counteract the “New Empire” will be those of the New Media and those who are willing to speak out against those who would enslave us with pretty words. Sadly we are outnumbered (as is usually the case with these situations) by uninformed and selfish minded fools.
re: #5 by Sparky
That first link, http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/06/16/AR2009061601923_pf.html , is awfully troubling…..
re: #12 by Ma Sands
My apologies, I was not disregarding those who had made comments but was wondering where others were.
re: #19 by jakee308
No problems….just teasin’ ya…. : )
i hoped so but it never hurts to express regret of stepping on toes.
generalities always cause trouble. (hah! there’s one now)
re: #18 by Ma Sands
It’s all about the collective rights of the state. Jakee has some good points also. Very troubling stuff.
On a lighter note, the wifey is trying to get me out of town to Yellowstone for the 4th of July week. Now if the gas prices will stay down, I might do it. Oh, I know I’ll do it anyways, never been and the 4 boys will love it I bet.
re: #21 by jakee308
I gots steel toe boots, no worries.
re: #22 by Sparky
Yellowstone –is that where Half Dome is? My sons were there, and loved it…..brought home some volcanic rocks before learning it is verboten to do so…….but, be careful…..last week a kid fell off….. ):
re: #15 by Ma Sands
Ha! Funny stat – viewership for ABC went from 7 mil to 4 mil the day the analogue changed to digital.
The “gub’mint” is concerned, but there are a lot of people out there who said no to digital. I like their salt!
re: #23 by Ma Sands
Half Dome is in Yosimite.
re: #24 by vapig
Is that the $40-some gadget that was supposed to be hooked up to each tv? My sister helped me get that thing, but it’s still sitting under the dining room table next to the tv, unhooked-up as of yet…….but I do have it, in case I ever need it….. : ) I think the last time I had the tv on, was for three days and nights straight, right after 9/11 …..
re: #25 by vapig
Sigh…..guess I am still geographically-challenged…..sorry…..I do try….. : )
re: #27 by Ma Sands
Now, now! The only reason I know that is because I’m from California and I’ve been there.
Everytime you good folks mention someplace I’m frantically looking up where exactly it is!
re: #26 by Ma Sands
I tell you what, Ma, I’m so sick of what’s on tv and for paying so much for it (I only have a basic package and am paying $80 a month, PLUS I’m stuck in a contract till next year) that as soon as my contract is up I’m strongly thinking of just unplugging the beastie!
re: #13 by Rodan
Just had another thought;
It is possible that the crisis may be one of natural causes. I.E. Massive eruption of super volcano, meteor strike, freak storm/flood.
Other possibility is due to our vulnerability to EMP.
With 2 antagonistic and chaotic nations(N.Korea and Pakistan) having Nukes and missiles, and another only a short time away from having the same, a low-yield fission explosion in the proper locale (say Wall St and Pearl St, NYC) is increasingly probable and would disrupt essential communications and financial channels necessary for the conduction of world wide finance and business.
The majority of computers and the electronic “backbone” of our communications network are not hardened sufficiently to escape disruption in the case of an EMP at the proper locale. The hardening of some has occurred but the cost is too prohibitive to allow extensive coverage plus the threat is considered to be too unlikely by most “experts”. (think Pearly Harbor attack by Japan; similar “experts” ruled out that type of attack and allowed our vulnerability to continue in the face of a known adversary)
The disruption would be immediate and life threatening. Without computer data streams our food supply system would grind to a halt leaving only what happened to be in local warehouses available to be distributed. Electric Power generation would be disrupted and in some places non-existent. business and finance would grind to a halt and banks would close. People would be unable to access their money. This would all take place within 48 hrs or less after the strike. Multiple strikes would be devastating. The country would descend into chaos rapidly with martial law being declared within hours of the strike. Depending on the number and location of the strikes the time to recover/relocate the data pipes could be months during which the people would be getting more and more desparate.
sorry to spoil anyone’s evening but hey I’ve had this festering in my thoughts for a few years. I have worked with military and civilian data systems and know that this threat has been known by the military and within government for quite awhile. It has not been addressed as the thought always was that we would have BIGGER problems to deal with as the nuke was presumed to be part of an attack from USSR. Now with smaller nations able to inflict damage at little risk to themselves this type of attack is increasingly likely.
As I said the cost of hardening the systems is very high with little assurance that the systems would be “proof” against attack. (nuke tests having been suspended, it’s hard to accumulate data and test solutions without an actual EMP) also with so much of our data stream owned and controlled by multiple exclusive entities who have no incentive nor the cash to spend on such a program without governmental subsidy. Which has not been forthcoming.
Even having the systems shut off does not protect them from this type of attack.
I’m not saying it would be the end of U.S. but it would be devastating to many and would be very disruptive to all at best.
But hey, what do I know.
re: #30 by jakee308
I used to drive myself batty worrying about all the doomsday scenarios.
Until I realized God is in control. Then I stopped worrying about it. It will be as it will be and nothing, and I mean nothing we do will change that.
re: #30 by jakee308
Back to pencil and paper, and walking barefoot, right? : )
re: #27 by Ma Sands
Hah, I have my own set of challenges so don’t feel alone.
re: #31 by vapig
And besides all that, He tells us to give thanks in everything, and rejoice always, as well as to pray without ceasing…… : )
re: #31 by vapig
Weelll, have you given a thought that perhaps the one that G-d wants to take care of a particular problem is YOU?
I don’t think that G-d is a cosmic bus driver and we’re all just along for the ride. This is a participatory Universe. If you stop moving and taking part, the universe can safely assume that you’re no longer functioning and will do some “garbage collection”.
Of course there’s a fine line between hubris and listening to the giggling voices in ones head and knowing what needs to be done and being in a position to do it and having the courage, confidence and conviction to do it.
Me, I was just making a projection of the possible causes of our new “savior”’s crisis in response to Rodan.
re: #34 by Ma Sands
Exactly!
Not only is Sarkozy speaking out, but Angela Merkel of Germany reminds us that Achmadinijad is like Adolf Hitler in the 1930s.
As LGF2 pointed out, it’s a measure of the moral depths the U.S. has plumbed under Pres. Hussein when Europe speaks against tyranny and we do not.
re: #32 by Ma Sands
Well the reality will probably be less lethal than what you or I may think. Depends on whether folks can keep their cool long enough for the emergency plans to be implemented.
Having a defensive/hunting weapon and a little stock of water and food wouldn’t hurt either.
re: #35 by jakee308
My job is to share the gospel of His Son, Jesus Christ, but I’m not a drone. I allow my “Father” to direct my actions, but I know they are my actions. And if He requires action from me, He’ll get it.
So what do all the leftists have to say now, who used to say that we need to be more like Europe.
re: #37 by Underzog
Isn’t that pathetic? Reagan and Bush both would have spoken out in support of these young people.
re: #40 by LanceKates
chirp, chirp, chirp
re: #39 by vapig
Amen! : )
re: #42 by jakee308
Exactly….
re: #39 by vapig
Good. Fair enough but that’s not what your #31 sounded like.
I agree, if G-d is an intrinsic part of your life then you will do what his will is with little or no “discussion”. I have found myself taking actions that I was able to rationalize in one sense and then later realizing that I had done them for an additional or different reason that was traceable to a requirement by G-d that those actions be taken and I was the closest “actor” available.
As some say “spooky”.
re: #45 by jakee308
Well, not spooky, at least for me –it’s a moment of achieving the spiritual dimension, for real….absolutely exhilarating….. : )
re: #30 by jakee308
A new paradigm is coming. This age will end with the arrival of the King of the Ages.
Back on thread: I’m more surprised that anyone is surprised by his “actions”. This guy voted “present” whenever he could. chart the path of least resistance for a particular situation and that’s where you’ll find this guy.
I characterize him as a crypto-muslim but it goes further than that; he is crypto-nothing. He is like a No-Ship and can be tracked only by tracing where he isn’t anymore. He has taken no stand on anything. He has backtracked, flipflopped, reneged on promises, made other promises that contradict previous promises. He wrote no papers though he was elected the editor of Harvard law review.
He represents the epitome of our “affirmative action” policies. Promotion due to skin color. His lack of decisiveness and unwillingness to stake out a position and stick with it is in response to the constant ebb and flow of the processess of admission and advancement in academia. He learned to be any thing and everything to anyone because his skin color prevented anyone from confronting him on his shallowness and vacuuity and assured him of advancement over others of greater qualification but who had staked out areas of definition.
Look up “empty suit” in the dictionary and there’s a vague likeness of him there. I’m surprised he manages to show up on camera or film and is not just some vague blur. If he didn’t I wouldn’t be surprised.
re: #47 by song_and_dance_man
Sorry. The Antichrist shows up first.
re: #49 by jakee308
True, but this pseudo moschiach will almost decieve the elect. I have no empathy for those who eat his fried ice cream.
Hmm, Obama as the “one who prepares the way”.
THAT fits!
I wonder if we can take obama’s measure and deduce who/what/where the “True One” will be?
For a long time, I always thought it would be “neat” to be around for the age of Revelation.
Now; not so much.
I would rather be left to live what’s left of my life without the strife, agitation and danger that I think I see coming soon. (sigh) I guess
G-d has another “assignment” for me before I am allowed to rest. I have to presume that all that has happened to me in my past has shaped me for the next “act”.
G-d be with you all.
jakee308
Are you sure the “man of sin” shows up before the 4th chapter of Rev?
I have seen commentaries on it being proof of a pre-trib rapture, but I have also seen others talk of a mid and post one.
re: #52 by jlfintx
He shows before the translation. It is part and parcel of the great delusion.
Okay, please provide scriputural references please SADM?
re: #54 by jlfintx
As it is plain to see that day doesn’t come until the Tyrant is revealed.
The notion of the pre-trib rapture is a lie and will be the downfall of many. As I said it is part and parcel to the great delusion that Paul spoke of.
re: #52 by jlfintx
Revelations can be chronologically confusing. The way I was taught and in further reading the concensus I came away with was that there would be tribulation and great strife when a great man would arise. He would be hailed as a savior of the world and his actions would appear to create peace. He would turn out to be the anti-christ and would enslave mankind (this is when the number of the beast will be engraven on everyone’s hand or forehead or they will not be able to eat or work or own property.) These actions will be the beginning of the end of the ages of mankind. I’m not sure where armaggedon falls in this time frame. whether the anti-christ causes armaggedon or appears after it. my recollection is that it is at the end of the anti-christ’s reign. I was taught this stuff at an early age and it was very confusing to me. It’s difficult for even adults to sort out the allegorical descriptions from interpretive descriptions of prophecy. Then there’s some sect’s of christianity the teach about a “rapture” that will take everyone who is left on earth that have survived the anti-christ up to heaven. After all this Christ appears on earth, destroys the antichrist and throws down satan/lucifer for the last time.
I myself have learned, in the midst of great personal tribulation, that the words of the Scriptures turn corners so quickly, that we may miss the interim…..for example, in the Old Testament, it was told that the Messiah would come in power, but the Israelites missed that there was a “valley” before that, in which the Messiah would come the first time, to suffer and die.
Once I saw that, I could far more easily see the same kind of “quick turn”, even in many places in the New Testament, in Jesus’ words…….it is because of this that I present the following, something concerning the Rapture, that mama winger gave to me last year, and I have kept as a treasure:
http://www.biblicist.org/bible/fifty.shtml
SADM, I believe that the pre-trib rapture is not a critical part of the “foundation” of belief in Christ. If you take that view then you are saying that teachers like Chuck Swindoll, RC Sproul, David Jeremiah, Tony Evans, Robert Jeffress, Charles Colson, Franklin Graham, Ravi Zacharias, Norman Geisler, Alistair Begg, John MacArthur, etc espouse.
I do not believe it is heresy, but just a different interpretation.
Which leader(s) do you agree with as to their interpretation?
I also do not believe that this necessarily is the “downfall”; certainly it would be a great shock for those that believe in a pre-trib rapture, but the basic tenements of the faith are not lost on this one interpretive issue I do not believe.
I am not sure which interpretation I hold to, but it does not matter to me. I know who wins in the end.
Oh, and thanks to everyone for their following……jakee308 and ma sands. My hope is that unless it is central to the faith, differing interpretations will not result in dogmatic claims that devide rather than bring together.
Of course I realize that is a two-edged sword since you have to stay away from heretical teaching, but unless it is addressed in the Word itself, I believe that any peripheral sources have to be dealt with very carefully.
following comments that is!
SADM
I do recall being told that the deception will be very subtle and many will not know they are being deceived.
I remember someone in the group asking about that, and also the passage about the “love of many will grow old”.
I think we can both see that happening. The argument I had with Jehu was the manner in the delivery of the message. I certainly know that Jesus threw the changemakers out of the temple, but he was full of indignation about what they were doing to his Father’s house.
When they turned their attention to him, he did not open his mouth. Along with “making disciples of all nations” I believe if you have offended the unbeliever (and I know I am as guilty as anyone doing this) you have lost the battle in trying to lead them to Christ.
The West is great for touting democracy before an election and then crying like girls when the results do not go the way that the West might desire.
Many if not most commentators in the West are totally culturally blind when it comes to non-western cultures. Liberal cultural blindness has been a MAJOR western weakness in assessing political outcomes. It has been the source of much war and suffering over the past 100 years.
This cultural blindness is a product of western arrogance and an assumed superiority complex.
Time to wise up folks and see the world as it is and not just puerile ‘coca cola’ copies of ‘the west-lite’!
re: #58 by jlfintx
Beautifully said! : )